Postado em Alemanha forum
I just read a story on Spiegel online which shocked me: According to a new study, more than 14% of German teenagers can be considered as "anti-foreigners", while more than 5% fall into the category of the righ extreme with Nazi-tendencies.
Surprisingly, the bad reputation of foreigners seems to be higher in those regions with little foreigners (so those regions where people don't even know what they talk about!!!).
The original article is here: http://www.spiegel.de/politik/deutschland/0,1518,613844,00.h
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To me - this is just another example of human ignorance, but for a foreigners living in Germany, these numbers are pretty scary!
What are your opinions and personal experiences with the way Germans see foreigners?
Vicious cycle
Postado por T Y em Alemanha forum
Vicious cycle it is. Forcing inclusive policy onto the refusing Germans sounds like brainwash though. Whether they like it or not, I think they really have to rebuild the country from scratch. I'm sure many would suffer from that kind of extreme resolution, but what they currently have has no end to the vicious cycle. And both Germans and non-Germans are totally fed up with it.
They should declare to become a pure white German nation and wait for progressive Germans to speak up. At least that way, no foreigners would have to fall victim in their quest. So far, we've been their gineapigs for their social experiment.
Germans have to stop kidding themselves and deal with immigration policy before enticing foreigners to move to Germany to help them maintain their economy.
Btw, they are already racists in many aspects, they might as well save some dough by cutting Auslaender out of their social welfare.
paradox...?
Postado por Usuario deletado em Alemanha forum
ah, but then it would be racist to not allow foreign nationals (or foreigners with permanent residency) to access the welfare system :D
similarly, i understand the German government can't forcibly silence nazis because of democracy.
yes, it's a viscious cycle.
in my opinion, this is what needs to be done: the government needs to re-educate the nation to follow the inclusion policy through the education system, etc.
problem is, the government can't even decide whether to include or exclude foreigners themselves.
i guess it's pointless to question the government's policies ^^ however, i hope they stumble across this massive thread one day, and use it as part of their research to understand why they keep failing the 'integration' problem.
i don't blame you for being pessemistic. i was really optimistic when i first arrived in Germany, but the longer i stayed, the more racism i experienced. i would love to stay optimistic too if possible.
Already happening
Postado por T Y em Alemanha forum
More and more people are saying they don't want so many foreigners, and compared to the last decade, they aren't so afraid of criticizing the immigration policy, and more politicians are voicing their sympathy as well. So the democracy is well in order.
They could ban immigrants from accessing to herz4, based on their status, but I just don't know how they can single out Germans of foreign origins to keep them away from herz4 though because when they say "foreigners" they actually mean anyone who's not of German descent. Its a so racist way to categorize the population, but that's how they see "foreigners.". If you don't look German, you are not German!
I tend to sound pessimistic about the current situation, but I just can't see the Germans find a smooth transition to a harmonious multi-kulti society. The attempts to turn Germany into a multicultural country by the government seem to only worsen the conflicts. And the foreigners are totally stuck in the middle. And it doesn't seem to be advancing in either direction.
herz4
Postado por Usuario deletado em Alemanha forum
yeah but the problem is, there are a lot of people living off the welfare. i don't like the welfare system here - i think it encourages laziness but it's a product of the socialist system and difficult to get rid of once people have become used to it.
to suddenly say there's no more herz4 would cause a revolution... also, let's not forget that it's the German citizens who vote for their government ^^ so if a certain % of the population say they don't want foreigners and more money from the welfare, well then, i suppose they have a right to be ignorant fuckers. it is a democracy after all.
i've seen a similar problem in the UK but i definately think they handle the intergration and immigration problems better. healthcare and public transport wise... they fail and germany is awesome!
Of course
Postado por T Y em Alemanha forum
Bureaucrats know it, government knows it, business community knows it. And they have a rapidly shrinking aging population too. But it always comes down to the willingness of the people of the hosting country, to create an environment where foreigners feel welcome. For Germans, we foreigners basically burge in to their country to steal their jobs. The logic is pointing them to the right direction, but they can't swallow their pride. So the more their government pushes further immigration onto Germans, the more they hate foreigners.
And since the government is not listening to the people, the Germans have all the rights to start a revolution. They want to get rid of foreigners and if the government lures more immigrants in to Germany, there could be a massacre of foreigners.
No wonder more and more good Germans are emigrating.
they need foreign skilled workers badly...
Postado por Usuario deletado em Alemanha forum
it's true that a majority of Germans don't want that many foreign workers (they could hardly find jobs themselves within the last 20 years). but the economy is better now - new industries are forming, past restructing efforts are starting to pay off, etc.
there's a few reasons why Germany needs foreign workers...
1. how the hell do they do international business with no native knowledge to assist them? guess?!
2. some people feel too good to do certain jobs so foreign workers replace them in that field. ie, builder, cleaner
3. apparently, statistics show that every year, more Germans are emigrating and less foreigners are immigrating so Germany has a labour shortage.i love economics :D
See!
Postado por T Y em Alemanha forum
No integration program or incentives for foreigners will change the German mentality. They can't attract skilled workers because majority of Germans don't want them. When does their government get that conundrum? It's like trying to fill a pond with goldfish while starving piranhas are in the pond!
lol
Postado por Usuario deletado em Alemanha forum
take a look at this article :D
Germany needs two million skilled immigrants: http://www.thelocal.de/national/20110514-35023.html
lol... they already aren't doing a good job of making foreigners feel welcome in the country, so they devised a plan to attract more! :D
awesome!
Integration
Postado por T Y em Alemanha forum
No matter how much effort immigrants make in order to integrate into the German society, if the society itself is not ready to accept them to become a part of the society, then what good is the integration program for?
Chinese who can't speak much English living in Chinatown in any given North American city are more accepted than the Turks who speak German living in Germany. Or at least if a Chinese person chooses to learn English, he or she has a much better chance in having a fair shot at succeeding than Turkish Germans who were born in Germany. It takes both parties to make integration work.
I mean it still makes sense to come to Germany if your country is in turmoil and don't have any other choice but to leave the home country, then Germany is still generous enough to receive refugees. But if you don't happen to be a refugee, I don't see the merit any more to live in Germany. Especially if you are from one of the G20 countries, you are probably not used to being treated like a roach. While we have to respect the German way of living, it's hard to accept the reality on a daily basis. The topic of anti-immigration is everywhere, on TV, radio, magazines, etc., and we are exposed to it every single day. It does make me feel like a criminal. Obviously we somehow invade their personal German space.
Racism will be swept under the rug forever in Germany. I just don't see the light in this respect. Unless they have Germany to themselves, they won't be happy. And as long as they aren't happy in their own country, they won't be happy having immigrants in Germany. And they are saying they have had enough! They want less immigrants.
foreign workers from other cultures
Postado por Usuario deletado em Alemanha forum
politically, they mean immigrants... though clearly that article shows not all politicians agree with that. lol?
"I don't think it's wise at this point to resist. it's their country. it's about time for them to be more explicit about their preference."
i totally get what you're saying but it's just nice to get stuff off your chest and realise that you're not alone :)
Germany is a conformist country so people here are raised to follow rules and i noticed it's quite important for them that we as foreigners do it too. (that's probably why they don't like us :D)
rules are meant to be broken and conforming is for douchebags! lol