Postado em Alemanha forum
I just read a story on Spiegel online which shocked me: According to a new study, more than 14% of German teenagers can be considered as "anti-foreigners", while more than 5% fall into the category of the righ extreme with Nazi-tendencies.
Surprisingly, the bad reputation of foreigners seems to be higher in those regions with little foreigners (so those regions where people don't even know what they talk about!!!).
The original article is here: http://www.spiegel.de/politik/deutschland/0,1518,613844,00.h
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To me - this is just another example of human ignorance, but for a foreigners living in Germany, these numbers are pretty scary!
What are your opinions and personal experiences with the way Germans see foreigners?
About racism
Postado por Usuario deletado em Alemanha forum
I think calling black people monkeys is wrong because it is like saying they are less intelligent.
However, if by the Chinese having no eyes you mean that picture that came up of some Spanish team for the games in China, I don't think that's racist at all. I remember doing that as a child, everybody did, and still I don't think there is anything wrong with it. The eyes are different, that's a fact.
That is the problem I see today, anything is labeled as racist. How about when we say Asian people in general work very hard. Is that a compliment or racism? To me, neither, just fact. Just like the fact that their eyes are different. Just like the fact that Nordic people are taller and blonder. Is that a compliment or racism? just a fact.
Would stepping on your toes when talking about a Norwegian be considered racist (to seem taller)?. Probably not because tall is accepted to be something good. But making you eyes stretch when referring to Chinese, that is racist? Why? Somebody explain why please.
Facts are just facts and they can't be racist.
Europe
Postado por T Y em Alemanha forum
If you ask foreigners in any given European countries if they have experienced racism, they will all answer yes. But if you ask foreigners who lived in many parts of Europe, in which city they have experienced racism most, I bet those cities tend to be in northern Germany, eastern Germany, and southern Germany. But no one is denying there's racism elsewhere as well.
You are just trying to be politically correct, but as a visible minority, I wish someone had honestly told me about the Germans. This is why sharing experiences is important, no need to deny it.
Different cultures have different preferences when it comes to multiculturalism. The core problem is that the Germans have been forced to accept multiculturalism although they never wanted it. There's a reason why white supremacists envy Japan. Multiculturalism works in countries like the US and Canada. But you can't expect the whole world to live the way we do. And when you force an unwelcome notion to the people and change the whole society around it, many will feel invaded. The rising racism in Germany is a result of that, of course not discounting racism in other European countries.
Fast change
Postado por Usuario deletado em Alemanha forum
I think there are a small difference between Spain and Germany, now we have the same percentage of immigration, but we have got our in just 20 years and several generations have been not educated in tolerance and diversity. Germany have more experience and they invest money and resources.
For example mine 1971, I met my first black person with 18 years old and she was the only foreign in my dorm. And the first from Asia with 25. A very fast change in a very short time. I think that is the problem. And of course, idiots racist, there are everywhere.Funny
Postado por Usuario deletado em Alemanha forum
The issues with immigration is same in whole Europe including Spain and Germany, but in case of Germans you guys call it racism but if Spaniards even call black people monkeys or Chinese with no eyes then its not racism. Oh yes, I forgot Spaniards call it sense of humor but its only applies when Spaniard says that and if rest of people say then they are racist.
I agree
Postado por Usuario deletado em Alemanha forum
I agree with you. Spain has taken a lot of immigration when it didn't really need it. It's not like the economy was that great even before the crisis.
In addition, there has been no control over who got in and who didn't. Therefore, crime rates went through the roof with immigration. This is not racist, just a fact.
Without immigration everybody in SPain (or almost) was white. Immigration has come from mainly other ethnicities. So if you don't like what immigration has done in Spain, you don't like immigrants and they have a different ethnicity so you could think it's racist.
To me racist is somebody who thinks another person is going to be worse (or better) just because the race he/she belongs too. That has nothing to do with being against immigration.
Racism
Postado por Usuario deletado em Alemanha forum
That's an interesting excuse to say that Spaniards don't get social help like immigrants so its logical for Spaniards to act as racist. But are you really sure that your authorities are very welcoming to immigrants....."Recently the group of independent experts which supervises the application of the UN’s International Convention for the Elimination of all Forms of Racial Discrimination described the existing Spanish regulations relative to foreign women who suffer abuse and do not have their documentation in order as discriminatory and requested that the Government revise the Immigration Law to end their lack of protection. The fact is that it also happens to victims of racist violence because, in the event that they do not have “papers,” they tend to prefer not to report rather than suffer deportation.
Socially, while the surveys denote a latent growth of intolerance, prejudices, and contrary attitudes toward immigration and toward our main ethnic minority, the Gypsy community, our fellow citizens are not aware of the racist behaviors that dwell among us. Many consider immigration to be “excessive” and a waste of resources, forgetting that immigrants create wealth, and so create an exclusive identity which denies cultural and religious rights to those who are different. They normalize the rejection of Moroccans, the marginalization of Gypsies, superiority toward blacks, phobia of Muslims, anti-Semitic reproach, and in a context of crisis and a convulsed world, an attitude of “Spanish first,” saving for another time the principle of equal treatment. Ah! But no, we are not racist.
On various occasions these international groups have demanded that xenophobic websites be shut down, but over 400 of the thousands available on the Internet originate in Spain. They also demand the illegalization of racist organizations, but here we have xenophobic parties who demonstrate with no problem. They demand that we legally punish incitement to hate, but in our country dozens of neo-Nazi concerts take place with no penalties. They demand that we remove symbols of this type from soccer fields, but here the ultras groups persist despite their legal prohibition. They also remind us that our legal cases must conform to the requirements of the EU Framework Decision against Racism, but our penal code has yet to do this. They urge development of effective instruments for prosecution, but we only have two Public Prosecutors for hate crimes in Barcelona and Madrid." http://movementagainstintolerance.wordpress.com/2011/03/22/r
acism-in-spain/BTW what black foreigner sportsmen get any social help in Spain then why they are called monkeys due to their skin colors???
"Lewis Hamilton was racially mocked and abused in Barcelona. But in Spain itself, Paul Hamilos reports, many fail to understand what the fuss is about" read the whole story here: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/feb/08/spain.sport
Speaking to Brazilian newspaper Folha de S. Paulo about the racism in Spain, the Brazil full-back said: “Unfortunately, I have learned how to live with it. Every match the crowd goes after me. They insult me, call me monkey.”
http://www.thespoiler.co.uk/index.php/2011/02/09/spains-comm
itment-to-racism-will-never-end
Racism
Postado por Claudia Aragón García em Alemanha forum
The little difference is that German complaint that strangers get the same economical helps than germans.
In Spain the spanish population doestn't get any kind of social helps like in Germany.
But people who came from other countries, they get them.
So it is a logical reaction to fall in racism when spanish people don´t have enough money to buy their children school material and clothes but people from other countries can afford this because they got all kind of economical help.
In Spain, Racism is mainly a problem caused by the spanish government.I feel the same in North Germany
Postado por Usuario deletado em Alemanha forum
Germans started putting their flags after football/soccer world cup 2006 games in Germany, before that I've never seen any flags in Germany. If hanging a flag means being racist then sure close to Northern Germany is Denmark, they even present small flag when someone gets birthday gift. I receive their flags on my every birthday. Even they put their flags on Christmas tree.
About Northern Germany I do not agree with you, as Hamburg and Bremen are the most international cities of Germany, and what about Hannover, Bremenhaven, Luebeck, Kiel, Cuxhaven and a very tiny town like Heide where you see lots of non Germans, there Germans also put flags outside their houses but on weekends and evening they go for coffee at Nilo cafe (coffee shop run by Romanian guy) then they buy their clothes from a shop run by some Indian guy.
Of course there are racists everywhere but Germany is far open to immigrants than big cities like Barcelona, Madrid, Valencia where Moroccan and other African people are struggling to survive. If get time then please sit with them and listen their stories of being badly discriminated by Spaniards and then compare your experience as Auslanderin living in Germany.
true
Postado por Usuario deletado em Alemanha forum
I have also heard that some Germans don't really speak that good German. Of course English is so much easier than German, there is not much grammar to begin with so I don't think you can compare.
Dortmund is only a part from Germany
Postado por Claudia Aragón García em Alemanha forum
Nicolas, I grew up in Dortmund, too and it was the way you tell it. But Dortmund can not represent Germany. Come to North Germany and you will not tell me again that you don´t see german flags all around. In the north there is nothing about multicultural or about integration and you can be sure you won´t feel the same way you describe now.